Arsenal the new Chelsea? Liverpool to be the new Manchester United?
Last year Arsene Wenger caused some controversy by saying that Arsenal were a true English club, this was despite the foreign manager and the lack of English players. In truth his point, other than having another dig at Chelsea, was to suggest that foreign ownership for investment purposes only detracts from the club as a club for the fans. He recently repeated this view saying that now Liverpool had been taken over then Arsenal were one of the biggest clubs left with a true English tradition.
Does Arsene truly believe that they “will be in trouble if.. their financial potential goes above their natural resources” or was he just trying to wind up the Chelsea faithful? We may soon find out if rumours are true that Oleg Deripaska, another Russian Billionaire, is waiting in the wings to buy up shares in the club. A rumour made all the more real as the price of the shares have risen by almost 20% this week, this despite Arsenal being recently being knocked out of the FA cup, the Carling Cup, the Champions League and possible even out of the top four following their defeat by Everton.
So will Arsene stand by his principles if a Russian Billionaire comes calling? Will he spend, spend, spend, or will he continue to develop his team gradually? Either way it could see the end of Arsene, he may resign rather than join the feeding frenzy at the top of the transfer market, or he may be pushed if his gradual progression is taking too long for the new owner. Alternatively he may swallow some of his pride (and his principles) and follow some middle ground, where he can combine the two?
Liverpool fans on the other hand must have had mixed feelings to the news that Tom and George are not going to follow the Chelsea model, but to allow Liverpool to fund its transfers through a growth in revenue, so following the Manchester United model instead.
Maybe they were a little downhearted to hear that they would not be in a position to financially compete with Chelsea, Man United (and maybe now Arsenal) for a few years, although with that disappointment may come the relief that they cannot now be seen to be “buying” the title, something that they have been able to accuse Chelsea (and possibly now Arsenal) of.
But in Tom Hicks recent statement there were a few phrases that may have been cause for concern to the Anfield faithful. Tom says that they will be looking to “generate as much revenue as the fans want to pay”. Its a slightly innocuous statement in itself, but given the loyalty of the Liverpool fan base, maybe the new owners feel that they can raise prices as much as they like, in the sure knowledge that the faithful with still come to see their idols.
This could see a further erosion of the local fan base as tickets are bought by those who can afford them, rather than those who deserve them - the Prawn Sandwich brigade will move into Anfield, much as Arsene has predicted…..
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12 opinions for Arsenal the new Chelsea? Liverpool to be the new Manchester United?
magnumopus
Mar 23, 2007 at 10:18 am
No worries mate, me thinks thou doth protest too much!
Let’s wait and see what happens this summer with transfers.
I heard Hicks say he has a large sum ready for transfers.
That being said he also will not buy the title like Chelski did.
As a fan I am excited to wait and see…
Robert O'Farrell
Mar 23, 2007 at 10:22 am
I love the selective quotation of “generate as much revenue as the fans want to pay” without mentioning the rest:
“As you get into the technology of building a stadium, one of the things you do is have a broader menu of pricing,” Hicks said.
“You have cheaper seats for people that would be attracted to that and so there’s a way that they can afford to go.
“And you have special seats and special amenities for people who are able to pay for that. But there won’t be a bad seat in the house.”
Paints a very different picture to that of prices spiraling out of control as money-hungry investors try to swindle us. In fact it sounds like one of the smartest ticketing policies I’ve heard in years- no block increases in ticket prices as many clubs now use to generate income (aside from the thoughtful few that have recently announced price-freezes).
Robert O'Farrell
Mar 23, 2007 at 10:23 am
I note you left this out!!! Paints a VERY different picture to that of monwey-hungry investors tryign to swindle us!!
“As you get into the technology of building a stadium, one of the things you do is have a broader menu of pricing,” Hicks said.
“You have cheaper seats for people that would be attracted to that and so there’s a way that they can afford to go.
“And you have special seats and special amenities for people who are able to pay for that. But there won’t be a bad seat in the house.”
Robert O'Farrell
Mar 23, 2007 at 10:24 am
I note you left this out!! (Paints a very different picture!!)
“As you get into the technology of building a stadium, one of the things you do is have a broader menu of pricing,” Hicks said.
“You have cheaper seats for people that would be attracted to that and so there’s a way that they can afford to go.
Robert O'Farrell
Mar 23, 2007 at 10:25 am
“As you get into the technology of building a stadium, one of the things you do is have a broader menu of pricing, you have cheaper seats for people that would be attracted to that and so there’s a way that they can afford to go.” Hicks said. Very different picture!!
It's a BIT(ter) SMALL
Mar 23, 2007 at 11:29 am
Once again Sack the Juggler gets an hard on by the only way he can, talking about Liverpool.
“Maybe they were a little downhearted to hear that they would not be in a position to financially compete with Chelsea, Man United”
where do you get that from????
Tom Hicks personal wealth is more than that freaky looking leprechaun that owns Man Utd and only a few hundred million more that Gillett!!.
I note you left this out!! (Paints a very different picture!!)
“As you get into the technology of building a stadium, one of the things you do is have a broader menu of pricing,” Hicks said.
“You have cheaper seats for people that would be attracted to that and so there’s a way that they can afford to go. - just thought this should be added.
and since you like to about rumors, what about talking about how Chelsea could be in the shit house because Abramovich is set to pull out and sell Chelsea!!.
ps was that you making post’s on another website the other day?? whats the matter your Everton (small) cock (small) sucking Website (small) not getting many hits!
small (smôl) pronunciation
adj., small·er, small·est.
1. Being below the average in size or magnitude.
2. Limited in importance or significance; trivial: a small matter.
3. Limited in degree or scope: small farm operations.
4. Lacking position, influence, or status; minor: “A crowd of small writers had vainly attempted to rival Addison” (Thomas Macaulay).
5. Unpretentious; modest: made a small living; helped the cause in my own small way.
6. Not fully grown; very young.
7. Narrow in outlook; petty: a small mind.
8. Having been belittled; humiliated: Their comments made me feel small.
9. Diluted; weak. Used of alcoholic beverages.
10. Lacking force or volume: a small voice.
11. Everton.
frank
Mar 23, 2007 at 11:47 am
If Arsene’s comments are to be analysed then one think must be pointed out. Liverpool and Manu have for a very long time not been English as they had such a wealth of international support and in my mind it’s the support that provides the nationality of a club not the ownership, that is, if the geography is being discounted.
Arsene has been the reason for Arsenal getting on the international scene and the Russian billions done something similar to the Chelskys. Both have some way to reaching the levels of support enjoyed by the north west giants, but that’s not to say that they cant build on what they have already achieved. For me Wenger only open his mouth to gain advantage as he is a manager who often ignores the obvious if it effects his team negatively while lauding it if it benefits him. A hypocrite but then so are most managers.
As for pricing, it’s a cheek that anyone associated with a London club should mention fans being ripped off, has anyone tied to buy a reasonably priced ticket for a London game recently? My last major game was the Juventus at Anfield in the European cup and that cost me less than £30.00 per ticket. Show me any other club that can offer such value for such a high profile game! LFC has plenty of room to increase the prices of their tickets.
Sack the Juggler
Mar 23, 2007 at 12:30 pm
Robert, some good points there - but it should also be pointed out that the US Billionaires will also be paying themselves an annual dividend of at least £21m just to cover their interest payments on the loan they took out to buy the club.
Its all very well saying there will be a menu of prices, but its a bit like Ryanair publishing cheap headline prices, it might only cost £0.01 to get to Rome, but only for the first four passengers…
Like Frank says, there is scope to increase prices at Liverpool and the new owners will take full advantage of that, ….as costs rise then so will ticket prices
Rich
Mar 23, 2007 at 2:05 pm
Sack - to be fair I heard the interview on 5 Live last night and I felt very reassured after a period of uncertainty about what our new owners will bring. My biggest concern to be fair was that between the two owners they had taken out this large loan to purchase the club - I just didn’t like the sound of it. There were also some high profile american Journo’s who were able to explain that of the american investors you’d be hard pushed to find a single one who would buy a club outright without taking a loan - ref Glazer and Lerner. Hicks also explained this and I have to say he did a very good job of reassuring me of their intentions. To me he came across as someone who wasn’t trying to say he was Liverpool fan, so much as he was just a sports fan. He acknowledged the amazing history the club has from its league and european titles through to the darker side of its tragedies. Both he and the Journo’s were completely confident they would have no involvement whatsoever in picking teams, or dictating which players to buy. Both Hicks and Gillette were talked about with reference to their baseball and american football teams and to me came across as being ambitious, willing to make significant investments to bring success to the club - but most importantly - to do so without going over the top, spending money like there’s no tomorrow, and certainly not spending it without bloody good reason to.
I think it was the evening before there was a spokesman for Lerner on 5 Live who mentioned at least 3 times ‘the passion’ he has for the club. Each time he said it, it just grated on me even more! Lerner has a passion for making a successful BUSINESS with Aston Villa - just like Hicks does with Liverpool. I’m under no illusion that you can have a passion for a football team cos you have spanked money into it. Otherwise every year I build a passion for some random horse running in the grand national! Maybe it was just a bad choice of words when the spokesman spoke, but yep - I very much liked the way Hicks came across.
I am very much looking forward to seeing the new plans for the stadium as I think it was his american football team which was described by one of the journo’s as recognised as being the best in the states. He even mentioned a possible return to the terraces! Of course I know that would mean huge changes to all football clubs, but raises an interesting question for you to pose and have debated on your blog - A return to the terraces - Are we ready to do so or just madness?
Sack the Juggler
Mar 23, 2007 at 2:41 pm
Rich - I believe the rethink on the size of the stadium has more to do with the short term repayment of the loan interest rather than the long term future of Liverpool, but I do agree that the Americans want Liverpool to be a successful business and they are the worlds best a getting every last iota of dollar out of a brand, so they should do okay.
Man United as a team don’t appear to have suffered under the Glazers, but I suspect that some of their fans will have in terms of ticket prices.
“Its a bit small” - while you’ve got your dictionary open, you can look up “iota”, you’ll probably find a picture of your brain in it… or a blank page…
Rich
Mar 23, 2007 at 3:37 pm
Sack - everything will have something to do with paying back their loan one way or another, so if they’re looking at increasing the potential of the stadium to increase the revenue they bring in, I don’t see how that has to mean a rise in ticket pricing. Hicks made it pretty clear how important the fans and the Kop will be when the new stadium is built, and whilst I can’t say he isn’t going to increase ticket prices, to say that he will is an equally blind insinuation to make. I genuinely believe he wants to increase capacity - possibly by allowing for terraces - and either keeping or even reducing the majority of seats for fans. I also have no doubt there’ll be sections which will cost the same as the debt of a small south american country to occupy - but that’s fair enough as long as the bulk of the fans are looked after.
What do you think about the a return to the terraces?
Sack the Juggler
Mar 23, 2007 at 4:17 pm
Rich, you could be right mate, and if they do put their prices up then I’m sure that they wont be the only ones!
With regard to the return of terraces, the thought fills me with dread - not just because I’ve become used to comfort in my old age, but because I will always remember Hillborough.
I’ve read all the reports about how it can be made safe, and that one of the key dangers (the cage) has gone, but I also know that whoever is put in charge of these things, if it can go wrong, or if there is a slightest possibility of screwing it up at some time, then it will happen and in my view its just not worth it.
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